Archive for the ‘mormonism’ Category

The Orgasmorator from Orgasmo

The plot of Orgasmo is that a Mormon missionary becomes a porn star.  Usually, this becomes a part of the conversation some time around the time that proxy/retroactive baptism, Mormon Heaven, and such get mentioned–

this device “comes” into play.

I think the right to keep and bear arms means  Orgasmorators, not firearms.

Make love not …

Anne Frank and Retroactive Baptism

Anyone who reads my blog knows that I think the Mormon idea of retroactive, or proxy, baptism is pretty neat, but some folk just don’t get the concept as this cartoon demonstrates:

With Mitt Romney once again running, I’m sure the kinkier aspects of Mormonism will be rehashed by the crowd that finds it to be a cult.  Never mind the proper name for the religion is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church).  Personally, I don’t see it as being all that much different from most protestant sects.

Of course, this isn’t the first time I’ve had this conversation, Cousin Avi had a debate with a Mormon missionary about this topic where he: “mentioned that I was a little offput by the Mormon’s posthumous baptism of Jews killed in the camps.”

An extremely distant cousin, who happens to be a Mormon, was correct when he told me that: “Baptism for the dead does not change anything for the person unless they choose to accept that ordinance. It simply makes it possible for the dead to accept baptism if they want it. It’s entirely their choice.”

It gets kinkier! Supposedly, there is group sex in Mormon heaven!

Yeeeehaaaa, group sex with the Osmonds and Mrs. Fields!

Maybe that’s why she took the option.  But, Annie would have had to have chosen to go to Mormon Heaven.  As I said to Cousin Avi, I hope that when they tell Rabbi Nachman of Breslau that he has been converted and he is sitting in hell that he has the option of spending the rest of eternity in hell, or spending it in a Mormon Heaven of blonde shiksas who will have polygamous sex with him.

I’m fairly sure the wise Rebbe would have no problem making up his mind as to what he would choose in that situation.

Anyway, this is a bit like Descartes belief on God, there may not be one, but it doesn’t hurt to believe. So, Mormons may be way off, but I know what I’m gonna choose if they are right. How could you pass up polygamous sex in the afterlife with Marie Osmond and Debbie Fields if they are willing to do things that would make pornstars such as Juli Ashton blanche?

Seriously,who could refuse wild, group sex with Mormons?

I know that I’ll take the option of going to Mormon Heaven if I am given it!

It’s the Book of Mormon!

It seems that quite a few people wonder what exactly Mormon missionaries do. I like relating the story from when I lived in Belgium (91-92) and the Brussels police busted a couple of them under “the Suss Laws” (Belgian Police can detain people for 48 hours and give them a litre of coffee and baguette). The police weren’t sure what Mormon Missionaries did. The law firm that we shared space with represented the Mormons and had to get the hapless lads out of Jail.

It seems the creators of South Park have spent quite a bit of time contemplating the question of “What do Mormon Missionaries Do?” as well. First, they did the film Orgazmo abotu a Mormon missionary who becomes a porn star. Now, they have a hit Broadway play with The Book of Mormon. I don’t think Old Joseph Smith prophesised that this would happen when he translated those golden tablets!

The play’s story follows two young men, Elder Cunningham and Elder Price, who are aspiring to go on their mission and spread the word of the LDS church. Price wants to go to Orlando , and Cunningham just wants to go on an adventure with a best friend. Instead of Orlando, they are assigned to Uganda, which is not at all what they expected (“there are no doorbells?!”). The boys think that they have all this faith, but once they have to put it to use in a 3rd world country they realize that it only takes them so far—the rest needs to be determined on its own. Throughout many musical numbers they express this, and also touch upon the value and role of organized religion in today’s society, how Mormonism is “all-American”, and even the story of Joseph Smith.

Wow! Now, is the US ready for Mitt Romney?

I may not be a Mormon in this life, but I know for sure that when they tell me in the afterlife that I was retroactively baptised that I will be eternally grateful in what can truly be called heaven with Marie Osmond and Mrs. Fields!

The Fear Monster Doesn’t like me because…

Lots of good reasons, but I like this young woman’s

I just wish her mouth was in sync with what she’s saying.  She looks like a bad 1960s Japanese cartoon.

And she”s cut off at the end of her speech.

From the Al Tirah facebook page

Fear MonstersFear Monsters Freedom means being able to brandish a gun.

Empathy Monsters And when you accidentally shoot yourself in the foot, to have the health insurance cover to cover it.

Fear MonstersFear Monsters Let’s face it: Glenn Beck IS America.

Empathy Monsters I’m moving to Sweden.

    • Empathy Monsters Fear Monsters gets their political news from one Web site that is totally comprehensive except for spelling and fact-checking.

Al Tirah! Fear Not!

When the heroes of biblical times despaired, God would speak to them. “Al Tirah! Fear Not!” God commanded. Good advice then, good advice now

A long time ago in a galaxy far far away, Jedi Grand Master Yoda, known for his idiosyncratic object-subject-verb word order, shared this pearl of wisdom. “Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.”

This year, anger, fear, contempt, cynicism, racial tension and religious discrimination have all bled into the country’s political and cultural fabric. Americans are despairing at the rise of John Birch Politics and figures like Glenn Beck; the hateful rhetoric and actions targeting Muslims, immigrants, gays, Obama and other political and philanthropic leaders; the severe economic challenges facing the country. They are despairing at the limitations of the leaders they elected to create change.

While this is a Jewish movement, I think that other Americans should listen to the message of Al Tirah! Fear Not! In fact, peoples of all faiths and nationalities need to remember this message.

The Empathy Monster is Americans at our best, guided by a powerful sense of responsibility and community.
Empathy beats fear when:

I seek solutions to problems, not scapegoats
I listen
I stand up to hate
I love my neighbor as much as I love myself
I remember that my ancestors were once discriminated against

Fight the Fear Monster!
This campaign is complete with Fear and Empathy Monsters who are already engaged in a Facebook faceoff.

Still More Mormon!

I guess I was so turned on by the idea of wild, polygamous sex in the afterlife with Debbie Fields and Marie Osmond where they do things that would make Juli Ashton blanche that I forgot to post this video:

Of course, if all that is true, then this would have had the amusing aspect of making Glenn Beck (and other Mormons) blasphemers under the Maryland Toleration Act, also known as the Act Concerning Religion, in 1649. Despite the name, the act provided that:

or deny our Saviour Jesus Christ to bee the sonne of God, or shall deny the holy Trinity the ffather sonne and holy Ghost, or the Godhead of any of the said Three psons of the Trinity or the Vnity of this Godhead, or shall use or utter any reproachfull Speeches, words or language concerning the said Holy Trinity, or any of the said three psons thereof, shalbe punished with death and confiscation or forfeiture of all his or her lands and goods to the Lord Proprietary and his heires,

What that means translated from all the 17th Century gibberish is that if you don’t believe in the Trinity: you’re dead.

Since Mormons believe that:

The trinity is three separate Gods: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. “That these three are separate individuals, physically distinct from each other, is demonstrated by the accepted records of divine dealings with man,” (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 35).

That would mean that Glenn Beck would have been burned at the stake. BTW, Did he miss how intolerant today’s Christians are to Mormons?

Be careful what you wish for Glenn!

You’d think that somebody who professes to be a Mormon would have his act together enough to know that there is a reason for the First Amendment saying “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”. I mean–look at Mormon history.

Anyway, the Constitution was divinely inspired (according to the Mormons): so who’s Glenn to argue with that one?

Arguing with Idiots

Isn’t it amusing that Glenn Beck writes a book with this title, yet can demonstrate amazing ignorance.

For example, when Glenn Beck and his supporters attack the lower-Manhattan mosque and then he attacks Barack Obama’s Christianity, saying “it’s not Muslim, it’s not Christian” and describing it as “a perversion of the gospel of Jesus Christ as most Christians know it”. That comes as the ultimate irony since Beck is a Mormon, a faith that some other Christians despise and discount while hurling the same criticism at Mormons that Beck makes against Obama!

For example, The Southern Baptist Convention has described Mormonism as “a cult,” a “polytheistic” faith, and theologically non-Christian. One can look online and come up with articles such as Cooper Abrams’ Are Mormons Christian?: The Bible and LDS Scriptures Prove Conclusively that Mormons Are not Biblical Christians.

The country needs to get back to the simplicity of the Bible. The reason our country is in bad shape is that ministers for the most part do not share the truth. Many endorse false gospels including Mormonism.

Better yet, check out this site! or this site where they ask:

The Mormon Church teaches a number of things that conflict with the Bible and are radically different from what Christians down through the centuries have believed. If the LDS Church denies the core teachings of Christianity, should it still be considered a “Christian” faith?

The Mormons have faced persecution for their faith, but Beck is a fairly recent convert (1999). Perhaps this is the reason he is ignorant of religious persecution of Mormons. Although, you would think he would have known about Mitt Romney.

And if Mormons aren’t Christians, then it makes Beck’s statements about bring the US back to Judaeo-Christian values an incredible absurdity: especially if one is aware that Islam is one of the Abrahamic religions.

Moreover the US is a SECULAR society as I continuously point out which is why Article VI has this:

“no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.”

And the First Amendment:

“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”

As he stands in the District of Columbia, a Secular jurisdiction. But the District of Columbia is a part of Maryland and Virginia. The key motivation for the establishment of the Province of Maryland in 1634 was religious tolerance, especially for people of the Catholic faith. The Province of Maryland instituted the Maryland Toleration Act, also known as the Act Concerning Religion, in 1649. The act called for freedom of conscience for all Christians. Of course, those who didn’t believe in the trinity were liable to prosecution. Thus Jews, Unitarians, and other dissenters from trinitarian Christianity practised their religions at risk to their lives. Furthermore, any person who insulted the Virgin Mary, the apostles, or the evangelists could be whipped, jailed, or fined. Otherwise, trinitarian Christians’ right to worship was protected.

Mormonism does not believe in the Trinity in the same way that traditional Christianity does, which leads to the interesting question of whether Mormonism would have been protected under Maryland’s law! Wouldn’t it be amusing if Beck’s Mormonism would have led to his execution as a blasphemer!

On the other hand, the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom was a relative latecomer, but it brought into the public realm separation of church and state as well as freedom of conscience:

Be it enacted by General Assembly that no man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place, or ministry whatsoever, nor shall be enforced, restrained, molested, or burthened in his body or goods, nor shall otherwise suffer on account of his religious opinions or belief, but that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of Religion, and that the same shall in no wise diminish, enlarge or affect their civil capacities.

While Maryland would like to be seen as a home for religious tolerance, it wasn’t that tolerant. Perhaps it is fitting that Beck held his rally in the historic boundaries of that jurisdiction. On the other hand, the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom is much more pertinent to modern society than Maryland’s version of religious tolerance although historians argue that it helped inspire later legal protections for freedom of religion in the United States. Of course, one could also argue that the Maryland Act was promulgated by the purtian forces making it somewhat of an act of toleration.

If that is the case, then Beck preached religious intolerance and entanglement in personal affairs in the heart of the territories which led to religious tolerance and separation of Church and State! Even more amusing is if one believes that Mormons are not Christians, which seems to apply to even some former Mormons!

Beck’s historic ignorance of his own faith shows him to be a complete and total idiot. Or to quote ChristianNewsWire:

“Glenn Beck promotes a false gospel, however, many of his political ideas can help America. Our country was founded on Judeo-Christian values. Mormonism is not a Christian denomination but a cult of Christianity.”

Or Brannon Howse, a conservative writer and founder of Worldview Weekend, which organizes Christian conferences, who criticized evangelical participation in Beck’s Rally.

“The Apostle Paul warns Christians against uniting with unbelievers in spiritual endeavors in 2 Corinthians 6:14 where we read, “Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?”
“While I applaud and agree with many of Glenn Beck’s conservative and constitutional views, that does not give me or any other Bible-believing Christian justification to compromise Biblical truth by spiritually joining Beck…
Christians that want to be committed to Biblical truth cannot “put aside” the cross and Gospel of Jesus Christ nor the supremacy of Scripture by spiritually uniting with those that proclaim another Jesus, another gospel and declare the cross foolishness.”

But that’s what happens once you inject religion into politics. Debates about the right government policy degrade into debates over who is more Christian than the other, or whether they’re Christian at all. It’s remarkable how many times people have to relearn that lesson.

Orgasm gun

Sedate me mentioned this in regard to Orgazmo at Cousin Avi’s post about Mormons

I think these guns are great items for personal defence: shoot someone and they start cumming!

A couple of spiritual good deals

It seems that one doesn’t need to convert to Judaism to get the benefits since it seems there are a couple of categories one can fall into to receive the benefits: Noachide and ger toshav. The last is a kind of green card to the “nation of Israel” that is applied to someone who has married a Jew, or otherwise lives amongst them, but hasn’t converted. It seems that only Jews are stuck with being the Chosen People, which seems to be that they do the spiritual scutwork for those of us who aren’t Jews.

But for some odd reason some Jews say in their aleinu: shelo asani goy “thank you for not making me a gentile”.

The more I know about Judaism, the odder that sounds. We dumb goys are not Chosen to be paragons of virtue, or at least try to be. Naw, it’s the Jews who have to keep kosher, keep the 613 mitzvot, and say at least 100 blessings a day!

The next super deal is retroactive, or proxy, baptism. The Mormons will baptise you after you’re dead and then give you the option of becoming a Mormon. So, if you are sitting in Hell, someone comes along and tells you that you have been proxy baptised so that you can be a Mormon and go to heaven. I hope they add the bit about Heaven includes polygamous sex when they tell you that you can go there.

So, you don’t need to be a Mormon in this life to benefit! Not a bad deal. In fact, you are sitting in Hell, if the Mormons are correct, when you get this option of accepting their baptism. I am not sure how you learn of this when you are dead, but I know full fucking well that I am going to accept that “ordinance”. I mean I am in Hell when they break this news to me.

So, it sounds like you can slide through life if you are willing to do the minimum of goodness requisite to be a Noachide or Ger Toshav. And failing that, you can choose to become a Mormon in the afterlife and reap all the bennies (polygamous sex!).

Works for me!

Retroactive Baptism

Cousin Avi had a debate with a Mormon missionary about this topic where he: “mentioned that I was a little offput by the Mormon’s posthumous baptism of Jews killed in the camps.”

Well, it seems my extremely distant cousin was correct: “Baptism for the dead does not change anything for the person unless they choose to accept that ordinance. It simply makes it possible for the dead to accept baptism if they want it. It’s entirely their choice.”

It’s not forcing dead people to accept Mormonism: it gives them a choice if they are dead.

Unfortunately, the most important fact about this topic seems to be left out: the polygamous sex in the afterlife! I hope that when they tell Rabbi Nachman of Breslau that he has been converted and he is sitting in hell that he has the option of spending the rest of eternity in hell, or spending it in a mormon heaven of blonde shiksas who will have polygamous sex with him.

I’m fairly sure the wise Rebbe would have no problem making up his mind as to what he would choose in that situation.

Anyway, this is a bit like Descartes belief on God, there may not be one, but it doesn’t hurt to believe. So, Mormons may be way off, but I know what I’m gonna choose if they are right. How could you pass up polygamous sex in the afterlife with Marie Osmond and Debbie Fields if they are willing to do things that would make pornstars such as Juli Ashton blanche?

And God proves his love by giving me a chance to accept it after I’ve seen he’s right.

Now, that’s what I call Heaven!

A really good source on this topic is:

So, don’t knock it if they are baptising holocaust victims. Shouldn’t they have chance at a heaven of polygamous sex with hot and horny shiksas?

This could get me to convert to Mormonism.

Naw, I don’t mean Orgazmo is my local Mormon Missionary. No it seems that if you become a Mormon and go through all the stuff Mormons believe you can have Polygamous sex in heaven for all eternity!

The Best bit is that through retroactive baptism that you have all the benefits of Mormonism in the afterlife! It seems that if you are retroactively baptised (my info is at the Mormon Church) that you will be given a choice when you are dead. So, if you are in Hell, you can say: “you bet your ass I’ll be a Mormon.”

I imagine Hell is filled with assholes like Jerry Falwelll and similar fundamentalist shitheads.

I mean hot polygamous Sex with Mrs. Fields for all eternity! Hell, that’s better than having Orgazmo as your Mormon Missionary!

Shit, she should get out there and spread the word as a missionary that Heaven is an eternity of hot polygamous sex if you’re a Mormon! You bet your ass it is, toots!

I’ll nibble her cookies for the rest of eternity!

Now, where do I sign up to become a Mormon?

Also, Will Mitt Romney reveal this bit of Mormon doctrine when he runs in 2012? There might be a renewed interest in the Mormon Church if they do.

And you thought the Osmonds were squeaky clean! Ha!


You have no right to read this.

The First Amendment gives me the right to write it, but doesn’t necessarily give you the right to read it. While the right to free speech certainly infers a corresponding right to hear what is being spoken or written, the First Amendment doesn’t explicitly grant such a right to read anything you want. So theoretically, it could be argued that no such right exists.

The key word being “theoretically”. As a practical matter, the freedom to read whatever we choose is such an intrinsic part of the US or British national character as to make legal theory superfluous. People would rise in outrage if government ever attempted to proscribe what they read. Theory and reality are often two different things.

Add in that my ability to write or say what I want will allow ideas to get out, even if there are attempts to censor them.

Now, I just moderated some comments about my Mitt Romney piece which may have come from some Mormons (Mormons and Jews tend to proselytise in a similar manner). They are happy to see people accepting their beliefs and defending them as well. I will defend their ability to practise their beliefs even if I have some personal qualms about their faith as an ardent believer that the war of independence and the US Constitution are a disaster and not divinely inspired.

The American War for Independence was satanic in my opinion, but I don’t see Mormons as satanic. Their beliefs are not satanic. I would like to think that the Mormons believe in the Spirit of the Constitution and what it means than what this country has become. But I also think most of the founding fathers (and mothers) would probably think this country was a disaster as well if they were able to see what it has become.

On the other hand, as I have said before, I don’t see any reason to give the RKBA crowd more of a soapbox to push their opinions upon us. They flood the internet with repeated lies. Repeating these lies will not make it the truth. And the RKBA position on guns is detrimental to society. which is made especially clear after waking to yet another mass shooting in Illinois.

As a lawyer, my job is to state what the law IS, not what I would like it to be. And, until the Supreme Court states otherwise, the Second Amendment protects only the militias which are organised under Article I, Section 8.

I have to update this to say that Scalia’s opinion in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. ___ (2008), is a piece of political hackery which he should be ashamed of if he truly believes what he professes to believe. So, I remain unconvinced of the validity of this decision as legal precedent.

So I see no reason why District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. ___ (2008) should not be overturned and replaced with something which makes proper legal sense or why Washington, DC’s locally enacted law should have been judicially repealed. Isn’t that judicial activism anyway?

Not to mention tyranny.

I am glad to see that I have readers and I am glad to support people’s right of conscience if it doesn’t hurt anyone. Quite frankly. I have absolutely no problem with any of Mormonism’s beliefs. As I said before, I think that they are absolutely dead wrong about the Declaration of Independence and Constitution being devinely inspired. Along with finding retroactive baptism a bit odd, which I am sure my dead Jewish relations who are retroactively baptised do as well.

But, My Mormon relations tell me that my Jewish relations who are retroactively are free to accept or reject Mormonism as they please. Not to mention that the Mormons have helped me in my genealogical pursuits. I have also donated genealogical material to the Mormons who will protect it. So, I have absolutely no problem with Mormons and their beliefs since they are not forcing them upon me.

The Mormons aren’t the Branch Davidians, yet I see some of the religious right defend the Branch Davidians even though the BDs were engaged in illegal activities. This is because they were a “Church”.

The Mormons are law abiding and not prone to force their beliefs on others, which is what the First Amendment right is about.

And, I really don’t care if anyone reads this blog, but it is my right to write it. This is the real first freedom which protects all other freedoms. The Second Amendment’s significance is so lost in history and polemic that it is meaningless.

But, it does feel good if my writings make a difference.

Mitt Romney: Mormonism and the religious right

I have to admit it is humourous to me to hear Mitt Romney being accused of not being “Christian” since he is a Mormon. I have had a thing for Mormonism since I was a youth and have to admit more knowledge than the average person about this faith. The cabinet d’avocats we were associated when I lived in Belgium represented the Mormons.

An anecdote from that period is that a couple of Mormon missionaries were arrested by the Belgian police since the Police weren’t sure what exactly Mormon missionaries did. Of course, this was well before the film “Orgazmo” was released (sorry, I had to put that in). Anyway, Belgian law allows for the police to arrest someone for 48 hours and hold them just to check them out. The Mormons were fed a baguette and a litre of coffee every 4 hours. Something which doesn’t happen in the USA. These poor buggers are suffering since they can’t drink coffee and don’t understand why the police can just pull them off the street for no reason.

But Mormonism is the most American of religions.

They see the United States as the promised land and the Declaration of Independence and Constitution as divinely inspired. Of course, that is where I find fault in their faith as a true tory, but that is a total digression.

And, of course, Mormons believe in Jesus Christ.

On the other hand, there are evangelicals out there who believe Mormonism is a cult. See However, I am going to quote that article here:

The first time I ever heard about Mormons was in fifth grade, sitting in a basement classroom of my Baptist church, watching a filmstrip about cults. Our Sunday school class was covering a special month-long unit on false religions; in the mail-order curriculum, Mormonism came somewhere between devil worshippers and Jim Jones. Although most of the particulars are lost to me now, one of the images remains in my mind: a cartoon of human figures floating in outer space (an apparent reference to the Mormon doctrine of “eternal progression”) that appeared on the screen next to our pull-down map of Israel. Even at age 10, the take-away message was clear. Mormons were not like us, they were not Christian.

Evangelical opinions about the LDS Church haven’t changed so much since I watched that filmstrip more than 20 years ago. In 2004, Mormons were specifically excluded from participation in the National Day of Prayer organized by Shirley Dobson (wife of James Dobson, leader of the conservative Christian organization Focus on the Family) because their theology was found to be incompatible with Christian beliefs.

Mormons believe that they are the fully realized strain of Christianity–hence the “latter-day saints.” They acknowledge extra-biblical works of scripture (such as the Book of Mormon and the Doctrine and Covenants), follow a series of prophets who claim to have received divine revelations, and teach that God inhabits an actual physical body. This is all blasphemy to evangelicals; they argue that “the Bible explicitly warns against adding to or detracting from its teaching” and refer to the revelations as “realistic deception[s] by the Devil himself.”

Evangelical Christians consider Mormonism a threat in a way that Catholicism and even Judaism are not. The LDS Church, they charge, has perverted Christian teachings to create a false religion. As John L. Smith, a Southern Baptist who runs Utah Mission–an organization that tries to convert Mormons–told Christianity Today: “Mormonism is either totally true or totally false. If it’s true, every other religion in America is false.” To be tolerant of Mormonism is to put evangelical Christianity at risk. And to put a Mormon in the White House would be to place a stamp of approval on that faith.

Southern Baptists have been particularly vocal about labeling the LDS Church a “cult.” In 1997, the denomination published a handbook and video, both with the title The Mormon Puzzle: Understanding and Witnessing to Latter-day Saints. More than 45,000 of these kits were distributed in the first year; the following year–in a throwing down of the proselytizing gauntlet–the Southern Baptist Convention held its annual meeting in Salt Lake City. Around the same time, a speaker at the denomination’s summit on Mormonism declared that Utah was “a stronghold of Satan.” When Richard Mouw, president of the evangelical Fuller Theological Seminary, tried to repair relations with the LDS community by apologizing on behalf of evangelicals during a speech in the Mormon Tabernacle last year, his conservative brethren lashed out. Mouw had no right, they declared in an open letter, to speak for them or apologize for denouncing Mormon “false prophecies and false teachings.”

Now, the First Amendment was proposed as a bulwark against government interference with religion, not to establish Christianity, especially fundamentalist Christianity, as a religion. The US Constitution Article VI states that: “no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.”

Why? Because the Puritans knew that government interference in religion was something to be avoided. Most of the faiths that came to the United States were dissenters in Europe and knew the problems associated with government sanctioned religion. Europe had nearly two centuries of religious war and a millennium of religious persecution to look back upon.

I was at a Jewish CLE class where the Rabbi said something along the lines of even though we may agree with the religious right, we know that we cannot support them. Because we are working toward something which may backfire upon us. So, we cannot impose our beliefs upon others even though we may not believe in abortion, birth control, etcetera.

Mormonism has a long history of persecution by “Christians” (see, which they should not forget. I remember when I was young seeing a memorial to the Mormons who went to Beaver Island to escape persecution while camping in northern Michigan.

I ask my Mormon Brothers and Sisters to remember their past and the persecution by those who called themselves Christians to remember what our religious freedom means. Even if Mormons disagree with positions on abortions, birth control, prayer in school, and so forth, they must remember that others have once persecuted (and still do persecute) them for their beliefs.

We cannot have religious issues blocking our other freedoms and the freedoms of others. We cannot have religion being used as a method for blocking real social legislation by making religion a wedge issue. we must allow for freedom of conscience whether we agree with it or not.

otherwise, we may return to the religious wars our ancestors fled their homelands to escape.